Podcast 24: How men can open up about their mental health in the workplace

According to the World Health Organization, one in four people in the world will be affected by mental or neurological disorders at some point in their lives, but worryingly mental health still has a stigma attached to it, especially when it comes to men and their mental health.

Despite women being more likely to be diagnosed with depression, data from the World Health Organisation indicates that the rate of suicide is higher among men than it is women.

So today, we’re joined by Business Psychologist Gordon Tinline, who is here to share his advice with our male listeners as well as, of course their friends, families, managers and colleagues to help men better invest in and maintain good mental health at work.

1. The term mental health is quite a wide term. So please could you explain what we really mean when we talk about mental health, and more specifically mental health issues or concerns?

Yes, well we all have mental health. I think what most people mean when they use the term, is they’re thinking about mental illness rather than mental health. But, we should all be concerned with looking after our mental health, just as we probably are and think a lot more about our physical health – it’s part of our overall wellbeing, our overall health. I’m very much a proponent of actively thinking about it and not waiting until you feel there’s something wrong before you do anything. I think that’s part of the picture.

The other thing is when we get into mental health conditions, have an appreciation and an understanding that there’s a wide range. We tend to lump them together as mental health problems, partially just because we haven’t got a sophisticated understanding, as we do with physical health issues. But there’s a wide range; anxiety, anxiety depression, mixed state, those are very common and through to things which are much less common like some personality disorders and schizophrenia, but obviously it can be difficult to manage.

It’s not that we need to be experts – leave that to the experts – but I do think an awareness of the range is important, particularly in terms of things that may happen to you personally or to those that you know or work with or that are close to you.

2. Is there any evidence to suggest that men are struggling with their mental health more than women?

I think the keyword there is struggling. Because if you looked at it in terms of evidence around who suffers with and is diagnosed with mental health conditions, women are much more likely than men to be diagnosed with mental health conditions, particularly common ones. However, the likelihood is that men are slow to ask for help and to get help if they get help at all. And of course, that takes you down the focus that that’s now prevalent for men and mental health, which is suicide prevention.

The stats tell us that the number of people who commit suicide, three quarters of them are men, and if you looked at UK numbers, last year that’s 5,000 men in the UK. It sounds like a bad thing to say, but each one is a tragedy and it’s obviously a tragedy for that individual but it’s a tragedy that impacts people that they’re close to, so it has an impact on their mental health as well and sometimes that’s a long-lasting impact.

So, it peaks in late forties but the one thing that struck me last year, looking at the stats again, was that if you’d look at young men, so 20-24, in 2018 that was up 31% in the UK. So, clearly this is evidence that men, more than women, don’t seek help or support when they need it until they feel like there’s unfortunately no other choice than to do something as drastic as that.

3. Why do you think this is? What cultural and societal forces are at play?

Well, you’re a man, you’ve probably been exposed to them, so, you can argue this for as long as you like almost. In terms of history, you know, back to hunter gatherer providers, it’s true to how we socialised, how we’re developed, how we’re brought up, and a lot of that is still changing, I’m glad to say. But it’s still reinforcing, “what does it mean to be a real man?” and a lot of that is about being tough, sometimes that’s portrayed as attractive. If you think think of things like the “strong silent one”, which was often held up as being something attractive, and all that feeds in. I remember as a boy, my favourite toy was my action man. It was definitely action man, it’s not “thinking man” or “talk about your feeling’s “man.

So, all of this just constantly reinforces this image that men have, and women have often, that being a real man means being tough. If you have feelings, you don’t really want to talk about them. You just want to get on with it and be active and sort things out.

4. In our introduction we mentioned that men and mental health sometimes have more stigma attached to them perhaps than women’s mental health issues. Again, why do you think that could be?

Men themselves when they talk about mental health, when they’re suffering, they often say that they do not feel that they’re ready to disclose, they’re ready to talk about it. Of course, you’ve got to be careful not to over generalise, there’s a whole load of variation amongst men and women obviously, but men tend to hold onto it and think, “I’ll find a way of sorting this out, I’ll find a way of working it out and dealing with the problem,” which usually doesn’t involve talking to others about their feelings.

One way or another that stigma is now being tackled gradually. I think we are on the right road with this and it’s really to turn this around a little bit and say, “maybe that’s not a strong thing to do”., maybe actually a strong thing to do, is to put your hand up and say, “You know what, I’m struggling,” and ask for help at a much earlier stage.

5. Do you think that that we perhaps need to address men’s mental health differently to women’s? What evidence suggests that perhaps we do?

Well, generally this is the same for everyone, but there are some differences, so research tells us that first of all, women are more likely to be active in asking for help and seeking out coping strategies. So, encouraging men to do more of that earlier is important.

The other thing that’s prevalent in research over the years, is that women tend to prefer more emotional strategies. They’re more comfortable talking about it and need to sometimes talk about, to a far greater extent, their emotional experience and understand that. Men tend to prefer more rational, action orientated strategies.

Now that can be okay because a lot of rational strategies work because it’s about working through, “Okay well, where am I? What’s influencing this? Why am I making the interpretation of events that I’m making and how do I influence that?” And that works for a lot of people, but I think one problem potentially with the rational side is that it can tip into, I’m looking for the cause you know, “What’s done this to me?”. I just need to know what it is, like it’s a single thing. And then once I know, obviously I can eliminate it or sort it out. But it’s often not a single thing, it’s a build-up and understanding that there’s a range of things you may need to think about and look at that is important.

And just the last thing on coping, one thing I’ve found interesting is that men prefer what’s often called shoulder-to-shoulder therapies rather than face-to-face, which means sitting alongside someone with a common goal. It may be more of a task orientation towards, I’m working with you to sort something out or it maybe some forms of exercise to fit the bill around that. But it’s kind of that preference for “we’re in this together and we’re working towards something”, rather than “I’m sitting down with you face-to-face where I feel more exposed”. And that’s interesting, so those differences can inform good practice I think. Again, being careful not to overgeneralise because of course everyone’s got different preferences.

6. What do men typically do in the workplace that is detrimental to their mental health. Could it be the expectations that are placed on them by others that could be having an impact?

There definitely is and there’s plenty of evidence that that’s the case and some of the stories you hear from people who, from men in particular, but not exclusively, who eventually then have perhaps some sort of breakdown, about how long they held onto feelings and the range of things they were experiencing before they talk to anybody. It’s quite alarming really that somebody feels that they’ve got to do this.

I mean, I do think it’s linked to what we said about stigma and the history of differences, but this kind of breadwinner pressure that the men are more likely to feel like that’s still their role and if they’re not doing that, then somehow, they’ve failed as a man. Now again, I think the good news on that is as roles change in life, and not just at work, then that’s beginning to change. But if you feel your status as a “provider ” is under threat, that gets to a lot of men because that’s how they see themselves first and foremost.

7. What can men do in the workplace now to open up about their mental health at work and seek help and support from their employer? As we’ve established, you know it’s a very difficult thing to do. Is it just about being emotionally open or is there more to it than that?

No, there’s more to it than that. It also starts with the language that men use with each other and what we do for each other. So, you know the phrases “man up, stop being such a girl”, things like that are just going to reinforce , “pull yourself together, are you a man, get on with it”. I think if you see your peers struggling, think about the language you use day-to-day. It starts with getting comfortable with being more emotionally authentic and open. But it doesn’t mean you’ve got to pour your heart out necessarily, I don’t think. I think this is where we’ve got to get the balance right.

If there’s a preference for a more rational or behavioural approach to dealing with where you are and working your way through it. There are specialists who do that and successfully. I think the key there though is balancing that and that preference but still getting to the point where you are prepared to be more honest about emotional experience to a point.

8. For those of our listeners who are perhaps leaders or managers up to anyone in a position that might be dealing with someone that’s perhaps struggling, what can they do to help their team members and colleagues? Should they try taking a different approach, depending on gender?

Possibly to some extent. If you manage a largely male environment, with an exclusively or largely male team, then I do think probably if you can do more to normalise discussions around how we’re finding demands and challenges and, to some extent, how people are feeling when something particularly difficult has happened in the team or has happened at work or whether there are problems that people are just struggling to overcome. I mean you can keep that balance between asking people to see how they really feel about it and what they think some of the options are.

But what I mean by normalise is make that part of what you do regularly. Dare I say it, not just on World Mental Health Day, but it’s saying “now let’s build that into what we do and turn it around so that that becomes good practice, businesses as normal.” You do see that in some professions starting to happen, to some extent. It’s not uniform, excuse the pun, but the police, to some extent there. The leaders in the police service understand that you’ve got to encourage this dialogue and so, the dialogue becomes absolutely what you do when you’ve perhaps been exposed to something dramatic.

But I think there’s a lesson in that for everybody. I think it’s just making it part of people don’t over think, why are we doing this? What’s going on? It just becomes something we do as normal business practice.

9. Taking all of this into consideration is there one piece of advice that you would give to our listeners and what is that?

I think for each of us as individuals, I really encourage people to actively think about your mental health. When you think about am I fit and well, think about mentally, in terms of how you’re coping with things. I think that it’s important for all of us.

I think if you’re thinking about men from a leadership perspective, for me, it’s about trying to help them feel they’ve got a bit more control over where they are and what’s happening to them. And particularly with men, I think that’s about signposting a range of choices and options. You know, it’s not necessarily going to speak to a counsellor as the only option. There are probably other things that are good for your mental health and “here’s what’s available to you” – “here’s what’s available” and “here’s how you access it” – and that’s important for everybody. But I think more so, for men, given what we’ve said.

Did you enjoy this podcast? Here is some related content that you may be interested in: 

• Why men need to speak up about their mental health at work
• Podcast 15: How to be more open about your mental health at work
• Podcast 6: How can you create a more mentally healthy workplace?